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When you go to ULX what will you be working on? I think exchanges are my faverate times to add and work on moves because you have tons of great follows and 1 million dances to practice.
I think ill be working on not counting in my head(more scat), not rushing, and a few fun moves.
scott
no moves... just rhythm
yeah...your rhythm is rather less-than-rhythmic. [Emoticon not found]
I used to work my mojo...
but now I think I will be working on polishing a few stylings I have been workin'
traci:yeah...your rhythm is rather less-than-rhythmic. [Emoticon not found]
[Emoticon not found]
I wanted to break free of my 7 move dances. For a really long time it felt like I was only doing a few things with a little bit of variation here and there. Saturday night at the exchange I felt I finally broke free. It was crazy fun. Also, anytime I dance with l'emily I feel so much more creative and it's then easier to come up with new stuff while dancing with other people. She should move back to Utah!
I've hypothesized that when I dance with someone that can't follow my creativity or can't create new moves from the ideas I lead, I arm-lead the same 7 moves. Hmm.... true or not true?
t_roach:I've hypothesized that when I dance with someone that can't follow
I get worn out very fast because it feels like I move myself more to make the dance work.
As far as leading the same seven moves I think I do that as well when I dont feel like a follow is getting the conection. On the same issue with not having your follow feel the conection I always try to figure out what Im doing wrong or could be doing better before I decide if the follow is not following well. Im not sure what you mean by arm lead though. do you mean you stop leading from your body and just use your are to conduct the move?
t_roach:I've hypothesized that when I dance with someone that can't follow my creativity or can't create new moves from the ideas I lead, I arm-lead the same 7 moves. Hmm.... true or not true?
Unfortunately it's true all too often for me. Sometimes though I just think "whatever! I'm going to have fun" and go all out and have a blast with even terrible follows.
And that right there is exactly why I don't really enjoy dancing with bad follows.
Before everybody gets all uppity, I make exceptions for new people, or people that are really trying to improve. What I'm talking about are follows that have been around for years and just don't improve (and just don't want to improve). Why should I work so hard to make the dance enjoyable if they aren't going to do their part? Why should I have at best a mediocre dance just because they don't want to put in the effort?
So some people care more about the social aspect than being a good dancer. Okay, great. Come and enjoy the atmosphere. But don't expect me to dance with you if you aren't trying to improve.
Maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I feel.
I agree with buzz on this one. I would also like to add that I think we should provide signs for these dancers they could hang them around their necks. I think it would be best if the signs said something like "lead me if you dare" or maybe "why wont you date me" or "let me reset that for you"
scott
Completely understandable.
gumby:"let me reset that for you"
[Emoticon not found]
we could have the BYU HJ hand them out at the dances.
Oh shoot! [Emoticon not found] This makes me wish the forum wasn't so lead heavy, so we can have the follows make fun of us too.
Buzz:...bad follows.
Before everybody gets all uppity, I make exceptions for new people, or people that are really trying to improve. What I'm talking about are follows that have been around for years and just don't improve (and just don't want to improve). Why should I work so hard to make the dance enjoyable if they aren't going to do their part? Why should I have at best a mediocre dance just because they don't want to put in the effort?
This is the clarification I needed to make in my post. I was discussing this w/ Liz on the way home from Saturday's dances. Not enough people "dance the music" as she called it. I call it letting your soul dance to the music. Some times I just want to yell, "CAN'T YOU FEEEL THAT?!" when I'm dancing with some one that just does rock-step-triple-step-step-step-blah-blah-blah to some seriously soulful music. Sometimes I stop and do what I'd like to call "micro lindy hop."
What thread are we in again? I forgot.
gumby:...
scott
Brave man, giving out your real name and all...
Well thats something you can fix Troach arent u in charge of the teaching content for the swingkids? I think id also like to teach follows how to take oppertunities to play a little more. These are kinda related I think. I also think when Im teaching ill start to try and teach a follow move each time that way follows have more of a what can I be doing here thought process instead of a what does he want me to do here thought process.
Hey its not like I gave out my full name and anyone who reads this board is going to know who I am unlike the arachnoboards. If I say something I will stand by it.
I like that. Standing by what you write! Buzz on the other hand...
There's a fine line somewhere within this whole "teaching follows how to do their own thing." I've danced with one too many follows who are what I like to call "a happy little monkey on a leash." I have actually stopped dancing just to see what happens... they just keep moving... wiggling on the end of "their leash."
heh
Well I think there comes a time in every naughty little monkeys life when they realize how to play well with others but they wont ever learn how unless we teach them. It doesnt bother me if they do something with the extra movment (such as skip to the side or swivle but if they just try to come in over and over again then it drives me nuts. I do something I think of as putting on the brakes. If it feels like they are coming in on their owen I just keep my arm straight and as they start to pass my arm they usually understand what is wrong.
scott
popthestack:...are what I like to call "a happy little monkey on a leash."
You do realize that normally happy little monkeys on leashes tend to throw poo right? Pop? Is there a story you want to share with us?
Buzz:popthestack:...are what I like to call "a happy little monkey on a leash."
You do realize that normally happy little monkeys on leashes tend to throw poo right? Pop? Is there a story you want to share with us?
[Emoticon not found] You used to wonder why I disappeared early that one night? Well, now you know. Next time I'm making you dance with the little monkey!
popthestack:I like that. Standing by what you write! Buzz on the other hand...
There's a fine line somewhere within this whole "teaching follows how to do their own thing." I've danced with one too many follows who are what I like to call "a happy little monkey on a leash." I have actually stopped dancing just to see what happens... they just keep moving... wiggling on the end of "their leash."
heh
[Emoticon not found] That I am.....that I am.....
Let's see....I believe the original question was: what will I (or did I) work on at the ULX? My goals are always the same: "Gee, I hope I can follow everyone's lead." [Emoticon not found] That's the real challenge of an exchange for me, since I am suddenly exposed to dancing with people I don't dance with regularly. I don't care whether they are good or bad at leading me, I try to truly dance, enjoy myself, and be original within the leading parameters given to me when I'm out there on the floor. Sometimes I'm successful, sometimes I'm not.
There, roach. There's a follow's perspective on this subject.
frutyspice:popthestack:I like that. Standing by what you write! Buzz on the other hand...
There's a fine line somewhere within this whole "teaching follows how to do their own thing." I've danced with one too many follows who are what I like to call "a happy little monkey on a leash." I have actually stopped dancing just to see what happens... they just keep moving... wiggling on the end of "their leash."
heh
[Emoticon not found] That I am.....that I am.....
I wasn't referring to you, but if you feel that way... [Emoticon not found]
You're not like that at all.
gumby:When you go to ULX what will you be working on? I think exchanges are my faverate times to add and work on moves because you have tons of great follows and 1 million dances to practice.
I think ill be working on not counting in my head(more scat), not rushing, and a few fun moves.
scott
So going back to the topic. Now that ULX is over how do you feel your dancing improved or what did you learn this year at ULX?
I think the scating worked well for me and it helped my musicallity to stop counting.
I also learned that if you scat to much you loose your voice very fast.
I also learned a few new moves to play with for follows and leads my faverate one for follows I call the chico play because all the chico follows did it when you would dip them. [Emoticon not found]
gumby:I think the scating worked well for me
google wonders if you meant skating...
i decided that i don't have to dance every song all weekend long to be happy with an exchange. i had a good time talking and hanging out with people as well.
i also decided that i need to start going to exchanges further east.... i'm having a harder time finding people i don't know to dance with.
so you shuld know by now that Im a horable speler. Did I spell it wrone or is gogle stupide if I did spell it wrone. please tell me so I cant fix it for the next time I spell it. as youre link tells me nothing acept that goggle mit be stupide.
Definitions of Scat on the Web:
* Animal poop. Many scats can be identified by thier shape, size, and color.
* a coarse particle of rock discharged from the milling process which is often crushed and recycled through the mill.
* The excrement of an animal.
* an animal fecal dropping.
* solid waste, or droppings, of carnivorous animals
* singing jazz; the singer substitutes nonsense syllables for the words of the song and tries to sound like a musical instrument
Definitions of Skat on the Web:
* Two cards dealt face down to the table at start of play, which belong to the eventual soloist and may be taken by him in exchange for unwanted cards from his hand.
* Skat is the most popular card game in Germany. It is also played in American regions with large German populations, such as Wisconsin and Texas.
* Skat (or Scheat) (d Aquarii / Delta Aquarii) is the the third-brightest star in the constellation Aquarius. The name is generally considered to be derived from the arabic word as-saq, meaning "leg" or "shin"; however, it has been argued that the real derivation is from the Arabic ?i'at, meaning "wish"[1].
Definitions of skating on the Web:
* in-line roller skates: in-line roller skates ( informal )
* the sport of gliding on skates
Google wonders if bobthecow is an idiot.
Also, why is scat both poop and a style of jazz singing?
So, scating isn't a word. Interesting. Scat also means to move away quickly, which is what I will do now.
Singular... "to scat"
Gerund (ie, 'ing) "scatting
popthestack:
um. you spelled idiot wrong. idiot.
Hmmm, I think I keep blending the thread topics a little bit by asking only somewhat related questions in my post. Honestly, though, I'm just glad I figured out how to start using this thing.
So, I do very much enjoy the Chico variation out of the dip, but I did have a few unfortunate incidents trying to use it when the guy wasn't expecting it. I also tend to get a little too much distance from the lead coming out of it-- so I'll have to play around with that some more before I figure that out.
I thought it was interesting how many concepts I had to rethink before I could dance with people I hadn't danced with before, but I think that was good for my bad habit of anticipating moves.
Other things I learned at ULX? Lets see... a couple of variations on basics, but I think the biggest thing I was concentrating on was trying to play with the leads I got and also on using my entire body (as opposed to only using arms or feet) to show a variation-- instead, starting to try to direct focus by looking at something to create a line, or isolating more.
It seemed like several of the leads were leading a little bit of a shimmy in blues dancing-- not entirely sure of my opinions on that yet, though, so I'm still experimenting with that one. I didn't really see anyone going hugely over the top on it, but I'm still trying to decide what and/ or how much it adds to the dance. Oh-- the other thing I noticed several leads doing in blues was a little bit of a stop-- kind of an isolation and flex at the same time-- to emphasize some of the pulses or beats. I'm trying to emulate, because I thought the contrast was kind of cool, but we'll have to see how that goes. I may just be making an idiot out of myself while I try to get it right.
This makes me laugh: I figured out who Effervescence was because of this post even though I hadnt read any of her other posts. I think she forgot to insert the word "panache" some place in the post.
gumby:I think she forgot to insert the word "panache" some place in the post.
Don't be silly; you don't just forget to use the word "panache". I think she's reserving it for special occasions, these days.
Also, if you really want her to say it, you might want to rethink mocking her every time she does. Tends to be counterproductive.
I think for some it may be counterproductive but not for Effervescence she has all ready used it less scence friday [Emoticon not found]
Then I guess "counterproductive" depends on what the goal really is. If you'd rather she stop saying it, then I guess your mockery isn't counterproductive at all, is it?
I find it funny how many people I was able to figure out the screen names for just based on their phrasing and the stuff that they noticed. Of course, the pictures may have helped, in some cases... [Emoticon not found]
And by the way, it takes great panache to be able to discuss the word panache on a forum. Way to go, guys!
Groooooooooooan
Effervescence:I may just be making an idiot out of myself while I try to get it right.
hey, everybody does. it's better to be the idiot that tries stuff and eventually does cool stuff than someone who does the same thing over and over again because you're too scared to look like an idiot.
This actually goes exactly into what I was saying in the good lines thread. lol...
True. You're going to screw up sooner or later. It's not that big of a deal.
I wonder if it is only a screw up if you let it be one? some times you fall or trip and hit the ground, but if you can play it off does it really count as a social mess up. I have follows miss moves sometimes and its not a big deal if you dont make a big deal out of it.
scott
Whenever I see a follow I know dance with a super really good lead I always ask "how is it dancing with ____?" I've been impressed by Julie's response to how it is dancing with Todd Y. and Peter S. She said something to the effect of "their lead is so precise, it's impossible to do the wrong thing."
Of course, that really only works when the follow knows and understands connection, frame, etc. If the follow doesn't understand that then it doesn't matter what the lead does.
So when I'm dancing and the follow screws up and apologizes I will often say "it's always my fault." A lot of follows will try to disagree with me, but I really believe that I just could have led it better. Had I been a better lead she wouldn't have screwed it up. Sure, a better follow might not have screwed it up, but that's what makes a good follow a good follow. Really good follows can follow anything, really good leads can lead anything with anyone. So then when they dance together it's even better.
It's my goal to be so precise that it's impossible to mess up. When you assume that the follow "missed it" because SHE missed it, then you miss out on a huge opportunity to improve.
Im not trying to be a jerk and there is some truth in what you say but I think that attitude is what leads to a room full of spoon fed follows who cant dance.
I know there are times when Ive blamed a follow for messing things when I just didnt lead a move as I should.
There are also times you cant lead a follow. for example if they have no understanding of conection. Lets say for example you move their hand up for an out side turn put your hand on their back to help show them through the opening and they still dont move you really shouldnt force them to the spot they need to be. a little push is OK but some people wont get that. I feel at an exchange your statement may be true but not in our local scene with all the new follows we have.
scott
gumby:Im not trying to be a jerk and there is some truth in what you say but I think that attitude is what leads to a room full of spoon fed follows who cant dance.
Yeah, I bet if you took a bunch of complete newbie follows and put them with Todd, Peter, Skye, Andy, Kevin, Marty, Falty, Mikey, Dan, and a bunch of other really good leads they'd turn into spoon fed follows that can't dance. Or even a bunch of follows with just one of them. [Emoticon not found]
I commented on connection and frame in my post. Of course you need that. As for follows becoming spoon fed? Following should not be mysterious. The lead leads something, the follow follows it. The follows should never have to question where they should end up. They can be surprised and think it's great that they just ended up somewhere without knowing how they got there, but there should never be any question of why they got there. If there's a question they might screw it up, which seems like the follows fault, but really might be the leads fault for not leading it as clearly as he could have. If there are no questions, they can do exactly what they want to do--follow. The super good leads are good because the amount of questions any follow has is a lot lower than it is when they dance with someone like me. And then as the follows get better they learn more how to follow leads so they have less questions with any lead. So then when you get two really good dancers you have no questions at all. Just pure inspiration and creativity.
So I disagree that this kind of attitude would result in "spoon fed that follows can't dance." Being able to lead perfectly is the goal, which can only result in really good follows. It's entirely contradictory that it'd end up any other way. You're trying to become a better lead. By becoming a better lead, your lead becomes more precise and follows have less questions about what is going on when they follow you and can therefore add more of their own stuff to the dance that the lead can use or whatever. Better leads = better follows = better leads...
Um... I think a dance isn't based on just a lead or a follow. I think the dance will be (in general) the sum of the lead and the follow.
Lead + Follow + Random number = Dance
The random number comes because sometimes you have an amazing dance even though you are both only decent. Sometimes vice versa.
I have had ok dances with not very good follows but it seriously felt like I was putting everything into the dance. And I know that some follows have had ok dances with me because they put everything into the dance. But generally when I have a great dance, it's because I lead/followed well and my dance partner at the time did the same.
Over all, I still stand by the saying that no such a thing as a mess up on the dance floor, only new steps (or syncopations).
Two things I'd qualify as real mess ups -- one where Peter S. tripped over his pants during an instructor jam and one where Nick W. did a spin thing into a matrix dip and (from what I could see) hit his head on the floor. Their follows still looked pretty good during those mess ups... hmm... (the second was sylvia sykes).
gumby:I wonder if it is only a screw up if you let it be one? some times you fall or trip and hit the ground, but if you can play it off does it really count as a social mess up. I have follows miss moves sometimes and its not a big deal if you dont make a big deal out of it.
scott
I agree with Troach on this on this one that was kinda my thought from the start was that. Its only a mess up if you stop and say ok you did that wrong or opps I did that wrong.
I really dont like putting all the fault on the lead if something gos wrong though. I figure once Im married ill be doomed to be wrong for the rest of my life, but for now if it is not my fault I dont feel I should take the heat in the name of chivalry. Also If something does go wrong Im not going to jump all over my follow and make a big deal of it.
Effervescence and I work on things all the time and we are very open about what we think the other person can improve on or how we can do something a little different. I like the fact that we can tell each other what we really think and what we need to fix, but I wouldnt do the same thing with a social dance unless I felt the follow really really needed the help. I usually wait tell after in that case and only do it with people ive taught before.
t_roach:Over all, I still stand by the saying that no such a thing as a mess up on the dance floor, only new steps (or syncopations).
Two things I'd qualify as real mess ups -- one where Peter S. tripped over his pants during an instructor jam and one where Nick W. did a spin thing into a matrix dip and (from what I could see) hit his head on the floor. Their follows still looked pretty good during those mess ups... hmm... (the second was sylvia sykes).
I found it interesting at the exchange that when there was very little space and my partner was sending me out into a potential fender-bender, I would use his lead, hit some odd-but-safe pose to avoid the hit, and the dancing would continue as though nothing happened. (Long sentence, I know) I then would then remark to my partner, that the circumstances just changed the styling of my swingout-- which was absolutely true. Sometimes it turned into a really cool move, and sometimes it just looked different. It was spontaneous and fun no matter what.
And that I think is the way it should be done. you cant control your partner but you can help them have fun while dancing. I also want to have fun when I dance.